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Shawn Gordon

Illegality Aside: Listen up, Fucktards

Published on 22/8/07 in Politics
We know it's a problem, but most fucktards don't know HOW or WHY it's a problem. Immigration is a problem being addressed almost too late...

Editor's Note: This is a long article and deals with a subject that many Drivl readers appear to be passionate about. Please take the time to read the article in its entirity before commenting, as it contains multiple sections and points.

Immigration reform has been a hot topic for a long time now, and most of us have chosen our sides. However, the propaganda machine still churns out a heavy amount of garbage to undermine and countermand the ideas most of us have already formed. Be wary readers, listeners, and otherwise active talkers; for the wording of propaganda plays a heavy role in our future determinations.

 The first move stopping immigration decided by Congress was a law in 1862 restricting American vessels to transport Chinese immigrants to the U.S. The Alien Contract Labor Laws of 1885, 1887, 1888, and 1891 restricted the immigration to the U.S. of people entering the country to work under contracts made before their arrival. Alien skilled laborers, under these laws, were allowed to enter the U.S. to work in new industries. By this time anti-immigrant felling rose with the flood of immigrants and in this period the anti-Catholic, anti-foreign political party the Know-Nothings, was already born.

After World War I, a marked increase in racism and the growth of isolationist sentiment in the U.S. led to demands for furthering the already tight legislation. In 1921 a congressional act provided for a quota system for immigrants, which the number of aliens of any nationality admitted to the U.S. in a year could not exceed 3 percent of the number of foreign-born residents of that nationality living in the U.S. in 1910. This law applied to nations of Europe, the Middle East, Africa, Australia, New Zealand, Asian Russia, and certain islands in the Atlantic and Pacific. In the 1980s concern about the surge of illegal aliens into the U.S. has led Congress to pass legislation aimed at cutting illegal immigration. The Immigration Reform and Control Act of 1986 allows most illegal aliens who have resided in the U.S. regularly since January 1, 1982, to apply for legal status. Also, the law prohibits employers from hiring illegal aliens and mandates penalties for violations.

But that's all boring ass bullshit... who needs to know immigration history to get riled up or become mentally aloof, right?

I was driving home from work one evening and a radio spot aired asking listeners to allow immigrant workers for the economic sake of this nation. It asked the listener to imagine "What if tomorrow there were no immigrant workers", and explained that if this were a reality then national progress would slow to a near stop and that ridding the country of immigrants would cause an unbearable cost of labor to hit businesses in turn causing them to fold, which would cost Americans their job. So far this ad has already misled the listener more than three times. The ad closed with asking the listener to be compassionate and think of their families when considering the possibility of shutting immigrants out.

First, the ad stated "immigrant workers". There is nothing wrong with immigrant workers, as it is the illegal immigrant workers that we want to get back in line and wait like everyone else. Forget the "New Colossus" opening stanzas and the false interpretations. It has become misunderstood poetry. It wasn't an open invite, but rather a commission work done prior to the competition of the Statute of Liberty. The poem embodied what the concept sketch made the author feel and nothing more. In no official US document regarding any branch of government nor how it is run, does it acknowledge that the borders to the US are, will, and must be open to everyone at all times for any reason. Arguments have been made claiming that America was built by immigrants. I can't say that the argument is untrue, but the times and circumstances were and are now very different. At a time slavery and sexism to a scale larger and more severe than any woman can understand today was commonplace, even encouraged.

On a side note - I just love how people like to keep tradition or revert back to "how things used to be" when it is convenient for them or their cause. No, fuck all that noise. Either put it all back or none of it. We can put back the old idea of America being a melting pot and jsut let people come and go for any reason, but then we'd have to bring back all the shit we got rid of too, like slavery and lower wages based on sex or race. Yeah, I know... progress is going forward leaving bad ideas and actions behind. True, very true, but at the same time be fair with how you move forward or we'll end up with some malformed multinational dildo in our collective asses - for what?... I digress...

Times have changed and these things are scorned and considered a social attrition. Using the argument of American being built by immigrants is no different. This country has been built, is in gear, and steadily moving. No one alive was a part in building this nation up during key parts of development no more than there is no one alive from the African American Slavery period of pre-Civil War. A nation that lives in the past on parts that favor the easement for any particular group denies itself the nourishment for a fruitful future. This is not to say that a nation must move on and forget it's past, but it cannot feasibly reside in it and expect anything good to happen. The phrasing of "immigrant workers" was to blur the line that separates legal status of immigrants. Legal immigrants should not come under fire for being here.

Second, we as a nation lack the logistics to round up all illegal immigrants and deport them in a 24 hour period. It would be something that happened over a period of time and as such businesses would acclimate accordingly without missing a beat.

A practical solution to workplace shortages include better workplace partnerships, or simply put – employee retention practices. While I worked in the retail sales business, the company I worked for noticed a shortage of employees.

To counter this they began to offer competitive packages that included employee stock options, slightly higher wages over time, and a 401K. Now, not everyone will want to remain in retail sales for the entirety of their career, but the 401K was not for new employees. It was for mid to upper-level management who had put a substantial amount of time into the company. Any and every business CAN afford to offer better packages. When a shortage happens they will do so.

Another common practice is to broaden their employee base. This comes in form of either ethnic diversity which reaches a broader audience, or by adjusting their employee age range. The latter ensures that the business also reaches a more broad audience than just ehtnic diversity. The company I worked for was specifically targeting early teens to young adults that enjoyed either the skate / surf activity (or at least liked to pretend as if they did - fuckin' pousers). So an age range wouldn't be as effective here. However, it would serve better in other retails sales such as large and small electronics, vehicle sales or food service.

Illegal immigrants often work in labor intensive industries, so in respect to the issue a realistic solution would simply be to offer normal wages to those who can prove legal residency and remove the floor on minimum wage for illegal immigrants or those without proof of legal status. Yes, it's a horrible thing to suggest ; to pay one person less money than another based on status, but this already happens (and with the fair tax idea growing wings, the government shouldn't have a huge issue with it on a financial level - if you're going to rape them, rape them the right way). I make less money than I could because illegal immigrants will work for less and do no more than I do on my "field days".

Many people argue that illegal immigrants hold jobs that many American citizens will not hold because they either pay too little or they are simply unwilling to do them. This is not a completely true argument. I live in Georgia, a state that houses the third largest number of illegal immigrants and is responsible for employing ¼ of the nation's illegal immigrants in the Agriculture industry (of which 92% are illegal immigrants), there is a huge influx of illegal immigrants. Most of them are working in either construction or agriculture. Neither of those jobs is overly hard. I work segued between both industries. Doing landscape irrigation and design architecture, I do some construction and have to handle some agriculture. I'm not sure about anyone else, but I've seen more natural citizens (blacks or whites) working at the drive-thru window of McDonald's, asphalt and quarries, waste disposal and management, fisheries, houses, and paper mills where those jobs scrape the bottom as far as prestige and glory. However, these jobs require that the employee have a basic understanding of the English language (written and spoken), and some degree of training. This however doesn't mean that these jobs are worthless and unwanted.

Third, business is a feral beast that is fully capable of self sustainment under some very severe conditions. The real issue is that business doesn't want to increase labor cost by hiring someone unwilling to work for less and thereby having to decrease their profit margin or keep the same profit margin by counteracting the labor cost with the installment of higher consumer prices. Most illegal workers make money "under the table". This is tax free pay that most of them send a portion of back to their homeland. In turn we have to make up for the loss of money at some point and it contributes to inflation and the cost of living; both of which have been on a steady rise. Illegal immigrants pay no income taxes in the US. If they pay no income taxes then how can we as a country pay for public services that both legal and illegal residents use such as police, fire and rescue, public schooling, and social welfare.

Many illegal immigrants send part of their income to their homelands. If money is taken out of our economy it causes a small short term issue and a very big long term monetary problem. This can cause an inaccurate account of money in circulation which partly causes inflation. Lastly, I am under no obligation to consider the feelings of an illegal immigrant when compared to the needs of my own family. I, like many of you, work very hard to make just enough to survive. Fortunately, unlike some of you, I do not live outside of my means. Still, my week day is long, hard, and bears little to bring home (compared to some college nerd who can work calculus in their heads but cant use simple hand tools - for the record - I'm college educated, but work int he labor industry becuase I like it). For all intents and purposes I'm considered a blue collar worker. I come home covered in clay, dust, and glue three days out of the week. The other two days I spend hours upon hours doing plant research, client meetings, co-contractor collaborations, and hardscape drafting. I spend 50 or more hours a week under a sweltering Georgia sun and often times go long periods without breaks or water. I am not exaggerating, and I do not want people to feel the least bit sorry. I chose this line of work despite the fact I'm capable of achieving much more in life. I like my job. The illegal immigrants are also capable of achieving much more in life, and they too chose to be both illegal and work under harsh conditions. If people can find no compassion towards me for the conditions in which I work due to the fact that I'm a natural citizen and I chose my job, then why would people feel compassion towards an illegal immigrant under much of the same circumstances?

The Mexican government has worked hard at trying to talk down the idea of a border fence that would span 700 miles across the US / Mexico border. However in Mexico there is a border fence that is there to keep illegal immigrants from crossing over from Guatemala and El Salvador. Blatant hypocrisy aside, in Mexico it is a felony to be an illegal immigrant. MIchael J Waller wrote "Mexico's Immigration Law: Let's Try It Here At Home", which gives a great list of laws surrounding the immigration workings of the country so willing to ask us to allow them into the US. Beyond this extensive rundown of Mexican Law and Constitution points, there seems to be a huge double standard that Mexico has. Pardon My English has a very interesting overview of some of these double standards. We can also look at Canada when in need of immigration reference. Canada has several ways to legally immigrate into their country, but you've got to fit into THEIR system of life and social governance (which is fine and probably best). From the Canadian Immigration website:

SKILLED WORKERS AND PROFESSIONALS
Skilled workers have education, work experience, knowledge of English or French, and other abilities that will help them to establish themselves successfully as permanent residents in Canada.
to apply as a skilled worker: •you have at least one continuous year of full-time, paid work experience or the equivalent in part-time continuous employment; •your work experience must be Skill Type 0 (managerial jobs), A (professional jobs) or B (technical jobs and skilled trades) on the Canadian National Occupational Classification (NOC); and you must have had this experience within the last 10 years. Investors, entrepreneurs and self employed persons The Business Immigration Program seeks to attract experienced business people to Canada who will support the development of a strong and prosperous Canadian economy.
INVESTORS:
The Immigrant Investor Program seeks to attract experienced business people to invest $400,000 into Canada's economy. Investors must: •show that they have business experience; •have a minimum net worth of CAN $800,000 that was obtained legally; and •make a CAN $400,000 investment. Your investment is managed by Citizenship and Immigration Canada (CIC) and is guaranteed by the Canadian provinces that use it to create jobs and help their economies grow. CIC will return your $400,000 investment, without interest, approximately five years and two months after payment.
ENTREPRENEURS:
The Entrepreneur Program seeks to attract experienced business persons who will own and actively manage businesses in Canada that contribute to the economy and create jobs. Entrepreneurs must: •Show that they have business experience; •Have a minimum net worth of CAN $300,000 that was obtained legally; and •Respect the conditions for entrepreneurs after they arrive in Canada.
SELF-EMPLOYED:
The Self-Employed Persons Program seeks to attract applicants who have the intention and ability to become self-employed in Canada. Self-employed persons are required to have either: •relevant experience that will make a significant contribution to the cultural or athletic life of Canada, or •experience in farm management and the intention and ability to purchase and manage a farm in Canada.
SPONSORING YOUR FAMILY This is pretty self explanatory in title alone. If you live in Canada as a permanent resident then you can apply to have other family members join you to live in Canada. It works pretty close to the same way here in America, with one "minor" exception:
If you sponsor a relative to come to Canada as a permanent resident, you are responsible for supporting your relative financially when they arrive. As a sponsor, you must make sure that your spouse or relative does not need to seek financial assistance from the government.
PROVINCIAL SPONSOIRED NOMINEES / QUEBEC SPONSORED NOMINEES Basically this is where the province / Quebec sponsors you to live in Canada.
Persons who immigrate to Canada under the Provincial Nominee Program have the skills, education and work experience needed to make an immediate economic contribution to the province or territory that nominates them. They are ready to establish themselves successfully as permanent residents in Canada.

Why Quebec has their own thing going on, I'm not sure, but I suspect is has to do with the political division between Quebec and the rest of Canada.

Another huge impact illegal immigration has is on Unions. In the north there is little issue with maintaining a Union, however in the South you'll be hard pressed to find a union of any kind. Lastly, medical care is affected by illegal immigrants.

At a time in our nation where good medical care is in demand and expensive, we can't afford to squander the resources we have here. As an example, the Savannah Hospital in Georgia has lost millions of dollars in caring for illegal immigrants. The government doesn't reimburse the hospital or physicians for their services and the illegal immigrants don't pay a dime for their care. Now, back in 2004 the barred illegal immigrants from receiving non-emergency care, but the illegal immigrants then went straight to the ER for any ailment. Aside from that many of the illegal immigrant bring with them illnesses and diseases that were once eradicated or near removed from the US; Chagas and cystercosis(not common, but noticed primarily in illegal immigrants) are just two that come to mind.

Illegal immigrants also have babies, or sometimes called"anchor babies" (prejrotive...with merit), which secure the legal status of once illegal partners. Often times the illegal immigrants will come over with their family and then have one or two more children. Sometimes the eldest son or daughter of the family will marry another illegal and have a child to also secure the legal status of not only their new child but of their partner. While technically the baby will not automatically make the parents legal citizens, a judge will opt out of deporting the biological parents because the result is a legal breakup of the family. However, when the child becomes an adult, they can sponsor their parents so that they may become legal residents. As many parents come to find out, birth is far from inexpensive and if we toss into the mix any form of complication, the cost increases seemingly exponentially. With the illegal immigrants receiving "free" medical care (becuase they don't have anyway to pay but hospitals can't turn them away thereby eating the cost), there is no option left but for taxes to go up to cover the cost of this. Moreover, babies with defects or health issues, receive full legal state funded health coverage which detracts from the coverage for babies born to legal residents. Hospitals also get further punished by slowly being required to have translators on hand for immigrants (mostly illegal) who have not or will not learn the English language. What it boils down to is that we're facing a serious problem, and with Democrats and Republicans talking out of both sides of their ass on the topic, it's left to us as Americans to figure this mess out. I understand the business side of wanting cheap labor and the idea of in turn keeping the cost of the product cheaper. I understand that when someone is in need of medical attention that they should receive medical attention.

I understand that when living conditions put someone in poverty then they must find a way to provide for their families, and I even understand going to the extremity of doing things outside of the law. However, I am an American. I was born here. I was raised here. I was educated here and I served this nation with great risk to my life. All I'm asking is that when I die here, that it is still the America I defended and grew up in.

Simply denying illegal immigrants an easy way in, or some form of fast track to citizenship is not fixing the solution (nor would it be easy). It's giving up and refusing to backtrack to figure out where the problem started. There is a zen saying that when paraphrased conveys the idea that "no matter how far down the wrong path you go, turn back". In this situation it would be far more beneficial to those who have worked hard to live here by legal means and have that birthright to live freely here than it would to throw our hands up as if to shrug and say "well... it's too late". I do not find that as an acceptable or responsible course of action.

Should we round up every illegal immigrant and kick them out? No. That would be a financial and logistic disaster, aside from being disorganized lackluster.

Should we force them to assimilate and tax them into submission by granting them a free pass? No. This goes back to giving up or quitting on the hard work that generations before any of us put into this country.

Should the legal status be revoked of those who have had anchor babies? No.
This will only serve to ignite tension and make the US to look hypocritical on yet another front. It would be better to remove the provision that grants legal status to otherwise illegal parents for simply procreating in the future.

Should we outright deny medical care to those illegal immigrants who are in honest urgent care? No. It would be inhumane to leave someone in need of medical treatment in a bad condition. However, slowly making laws that clearly define the definition of "urgent" and allowing highly trained medical professional determine and classify this definition would be a better alternative then placing that power into the hands of a medically untrained politician. Hell, I barely believe most politicians tell the truth outside of words like "a", "the" and "and", so I surely don't trust them to make an accurate definition of a medical condition above a doctor. Over a course of years, a small portion of the money that would have been lost in medical care by hospitals should be redistributed to countries like Mexico so that they can have a staff of medical doctors and nurses to treat the conditions that cause some immigrants to illegally seek care in the US. Then the illegal immigrants that come from beyond Mexico can stop at Mexico and receive treatment at a much closer facility with a staff trained just as well.

Immigrants – okay. Illegal immigrants – not okay.

I'm tired of feeling as if Mexico's biggest import is US dollars and their biggest export is illegal immigrants.

Now, most of that was the wish-washy shit but it makes sense to me. Though, people don't really listen to reason too well, and when they do it is dictated to them by CNN, FOX, and whatever ass clown decided they wanted to read "news" off of a teleprompter. Here's a clue people: don't take information from these sources to freely. They're the one's that spend weeks on what Britney Spears does with her kids or what that Trim Spa bitch dies from for months, yet talks about real news for minutes on the day.
 

This bullshit I keep hearing about making the immigration process easier and how that will decrease the sure in illegal immigration is... laughable, because the logic behind it is flat retarded and overlooks what poor people often think about - MONEY

So, let's break this down into a language most people understand - money.

I work with about 17 guys who have no intention of becoming a citizen. They come to the US for 8 months, then go back home for 4 to be with their family. They just want more money. They get home, live well, and then smuggle themselves back in. Many times, these same guys send money home so they can buy passage for their brothers, cousins, nephews, uncles. So, in some cases, the money they send out goes to helping others get in so they can send more money out... and people want to make that EASIER? The game will be the same my friends. Changing the rules to be easier will only make it easier to exploit.

If Country B has a "dollar" that is worth .50 cents and Country A has a "dollar" that is worth $1, logically you hop over to Country A to work and send it back to Country B because instead of sending over $1, you've virtually sent $2. The other thing to consider is that the cost of living in America is substantially higher than say... Mexico or El Salvador. So, the value of the virtual $2 grows even more.

These people DO give up a lot... but they gain so much more. ON MY TIME AND MONEY.

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23 Comments

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I see the bit about Canadian sponsors having to be responsible for the financial stability of the immigrants they sponsor... Not sure if you're saying that this is different to the U.S. system, but the U.S. system does require that the sponsor agree to financially support the immigrant. We even had my father in law act as a co-sponsor because we hadn't had jobs for very long, but it turned out that my husband alone was fine. Written on 22/8/07
This is true Jane. But, there is really no way to ensure that you're being financially supported beyond the initial checks. Sure, if it ever came to it you would have a "fun" time getting welfare, but WIC and Medicaid would be a snap (if you were an ethnic minority). It is my understanding that in Canada they actually complete that circle and try and keep people coming into their country from "dropping anchor" with a low wage job and successfully apply for the Canadian version of WIC.

Aside from that you came here with aspirations of being more than a cleaning lady. I'll go out on a limb here and say that you also probably had a better handle on the English language than most of the Americans you met. Obviously, based on your article you attended college here so you weren't looking to just... do nothing and send money back home... Written on 22/8/07
I didn't realize Canada attempt to stop this from happening... the American system legally binds my husband into supporting me if I crap out and lose my job, but like child support, I bet people do get left getting money from the state. "Legally bound" sounds threatening, but as you point out in the article, even illegal immigrants get tax-funded benefits that they haven't paid for. And yes, you guess correctly: I'm not sending anything back to New Zealand except for emails :) Written on 22/8/07
Yes I registered just to comment >.<

I'm a girl from the Netherlands, in love with an American boy. I've got my bachelor's degree in computer science, make an okay amount of money and I dream of one day finally being able to be with my American boy.

BUT, because I refuse to get married for a greencard, it really is an impossible mission to get in your country. I've been trying for two years now.

You said: "This bullshit I keep hearing about making the immigration process easier and how that will decrease the sure in illegal immigration is... laughable"

How can I come legally? I want to work there and spend my money there and live there, but it's fucking impossible now. To get a work permit/VISA I need to have a job lined up and an employer to sponsor me, but in order to look for a job I am told I need a VISA as well.

Oh and of course there's only a few spots for those work permits, I think only 25% of people being sponsored and hired actually get in before the quota runs out.

I will not go illegally, I worked too hard to screw everything up like that. But I'm starting to think there's no legal way for me to come in. If it's too easy now, what am I missing?


Written on 23/8/07
Daisy, that's the bummer about borders. If you fall in love with someone from across a border you have play by the rules of the person you want to be with.

It's absolutely no different if this American blokey wants to be with you in the Netherlands is it? In fact, the Neth have some pretty tough immigration laws if I remember correctly.

So if you love him more than your aversion to marriage, you'll play by rules of the nation he's from.

If not - you'll stay in the EU. Written on 23/8/07
Hehe I have no aversion to marriage at all, it is quite sacred to me, which is why we are not using marriage as a way for me to come in, as we want to be absolutely sure our love was built to last.

We have strict immigration laws as well, but it is easier to come visit for a while, my boyfriend can stay up to 6 months without a Visa, which he has done last year.

I will definately play by the rules and I wont give up. Any advice is greatly appreciated though ;) Written on 24/8/07
Therein lies the irony . . . and the problem. So many are trying to do it the right way, and go through so much heartache to get it done. America is missing out on quality skilled laborers while ditch-diggers are illegally walking across the border, wreaking havoc on American society, and refusing to integrate into the culture. It's sickening. Written on 30/8/07
I'm an immigrant myself. My father arrived in America when I was yet to be born, my mother arrived when I was 3, and I came here from China when I was 5. My grandmother had some connections to people who were in the states and people in China who dealt with emigration. Everything was laid out for us.

Now, I can honestly say I think the American immigration system is bullshit. Having come from China, I've seen hardships. I lived in a rather large town near Beijing. It's nothing at all like America. Nearly any street you walk into, there's a beggar, a cripple, or starving children asking you for money. And the town is a rather wealthy town in China. You don't even want to know about the poorer regions.

A few guys coming in our borders and stealing our a bit of our economy isn't the end of the world. We may struggle but these people are coming in and getting better lives. Locking our borders will keep our economy safe, but the rest of the world will grow overpopulated and their economies will begin to fail. These capitalist bastards are basically slaughtering these foreign people, just like they did the natives to this land. I'll admit, completely opening up borders would be a disaster. It's a shame socialism didn't work.

Stereotypically, people think of immigrants as Mexicans. But good, honest, hardworking people come here as well. My parents both went to great colleges in China. But their degrees didn't matter here. It was all foreign. So both of my parents went to college again and both got American degrees. My father is currently a programmer for NFL films and my mother is a dental hygienist.

I do believe, though, that many immigrants are taking advantage of many policies and getting benefits they should not be getting.

So what should we do? I don't think anybody has a solution to the problem, but I think our best possible action is to stop illegal immigration as best as we can and keep legal immigration the way it is. Written on 23/8/07
A few guys coming in our borders and stealing our a bit of our economy isn't the end of the world. We may struggle but these people are coming in and getting better lives. Locking our borders will keep our economy safe, but the rest of the world will grow overpopulated and their economies will begin to fail. These capitalist bastards are basically slaughtering these foreign people, just like they did the natives to this land. I'll admit, completely opening up borders would be a disaster. It's a shame socialism didn't work.

First< i'd like to remind you that capitalism is what powers YOUR ability to keep what you own. Nobody, and I mean nobody, knows how to better spend MY money better than me. This is why I'm not a Democrat. If I earn it, it is mine. Everyone is afforded the same opportunity in this country - even if it isn't under the same means. This is why I'm not socialist.

Second, Basically what you said in that paragraph I'll only really answer with: Not my problem.

It isn't my problem if an immigrant has a hard time dealing with the government of their nation and comes to illegally seek refuge.

Blacks were mistreated for decades, and they rose up and told "the man" to "fuck off". I work with a couple dozen Mexican, El Salvadorian, and various other Central / South American immigrants. They do tell me the kinds of hardships they have in their country - what with the poor and corrupt government. I'd feel worse about it, or at least slightly bad for them if they actually did something other than run from the problem. They don't ask for help, they just take what they want - illegally. I'd think that collectively they could enforce change for the better - instead they head north .

Everyone brings up the Native Americans and how the Europeans came over here and rocked their socks off... um... and? It's not that time period anymore and I'm sure that if we hadn't killed off 90% of them, we'd be picking the corn from their shit as we speak (reciprocities and all). Was it right? no. So why then are we going to allow it to happen again? Sure, they're not killing us off, but they are killing off our economy, work force structure, and real estate.

Stereotypically people DO NOT think of immigrants as Mexican. They think of ILLEGAL immigrants as Mexican - because they are. You don't find many illegal Haitian immigrants or illegal Nigerian immigrants... or hell... you don't find many illegal Iranian immigrants. Some how these people form nations FAR more impoverished than Mexico find some way to get here legally.

Both of your parents went to college. It's uncommon for an illegal immigrant hailing south of the US border to come over with more than an 8th grade education. Most, when they arrive do nothing to further their education (hence the dual language labels on everything). They'll learn some conversational English, but enough to get employed. They guys I work with, despite the fact I'm the only thing that keeps them employed - refuse to speak English unless I say "No inglés, no trabajo. Si usted no entiende inglés, a casa ahora vaya". (No English, no work. If you can't understand English go home now). Usually no one leaves, then I sayd "By show of hands how many of you can operate medium to light duty machinery?"

Then... some people leave. I'm sorry, I'm not going to learn a whole new language because there are some who refuse to learn the language I speak. I don't need something from them, so I'll be damnned if I hyper extend myself to help them. Written on 25/8/07
sure, capitalism empowers you to keep your own. always remember that capitalism also empowers other members of your society (or in this case, even your government) to TAKE what is your's in a moment of weakness. a good example is the administration of health care in this country, and it's painful to watch insurance companies benefit from the ailments of the peasants.

that problem is'nt just apparent in the health care industry, it's present in just about ANY industry, because capitalism is'nt about humanity and supporting yourself and your fellow beings... it's about fuelling a cycle of greed that tries to portray itself as predatorial, but is in essence parasitic.

do you really believe what you said about how 'everyone has the same opportunity in this country'? just looking at bi-party elections, the record gap between rich and poor, the ever present administrative racism, etc etc, makes me sick to my stomach.

i'm not saying capitalism did'nt have promise. it DID, like just about ever other socio-economic system we've come across. the problems arise from corrupt implementation; and that corruption is caused by good old-fashioned power-drunk greed.

just trying to acknowledge some critique capitalism has to deal with...
________________

second, you said 'Not my problem.', when the Chinese guy (girl?) mentioned how things are bad back home. that's some pretty hard, two-faced bullshit coming from an american, considering what your government is doing in iraq (don't forget the pretension from the invasion to current)

america has chosen to meddle in the affairs of other countries. this country will, unfortunately for it's tax-payers, have to deal with those consequences.

besides, don't forget the great marketing we in america get on international media, where 'USA #1!' echoes on screens in far-east asia like a giant holograph. don't expect to show people the cake and not expect them to want a slice. or three. (other cultures get greedy too, you know...)

maybe it is'nt YOUR problem, per se, considering you choose to live a life coccooned in a haze of ignorance while trying to validate your xenophobia, but you will have to deal with the consequences of your government's actions.
__________________

you mentioned how blacks were 'mistreated' (you probably meant raped, killed, enslaved, tortured) but we'll let that pass. it's a beautiful thing for person to stand up for his/her right to live a happy, peaceful life, and you got to give it to the black man and woman for finding their voice. sure, that voice has momentum that reverberates even today, but so be it. it's a small price to pay for all the free work the early americans got done

the time approaches for illegal immigrants to do the same, as we can see in the way they choose to demand respect should they be denied, and i can't wait to watch that fruit ripen

you said 'they don't ask for help, they just take what they want-illegally'... well, i'm not a proponent of karmic systems and all that hippy bs, but i do like it when people get just desserts, and the european settlers have had this coming...

perhaps it's time they got their socks rocked off by a new bunch of settlers : )

i know most immigrants are a little less callous and a little more respectful of human life, and i'm fairly certain they will not attempt to 'kill off 90%' of us. that may prove to be their undoing, because i'm sure america loathes the thought of picking corn from foreign shit just as much as you do...

remember that our economy DOES run on illegal immigrants. do not forget that it's OUR lazy asses that create jobs for them, especially since they'll do it better, AND cheaper.

they won't kill this economy; they will, however, give it a fresh, new perspective, and judging by the deficit, bla bla bla, things could only get better for it.

killing of OUR real estate? that's funny. to put it simply, none of the real estate in america belongs to anyone apart from the native americans. the sooner you accept that fact the better. just because you killed them all does'nt mean it's your's, just like if i stole your car today, it's not mine tommorrow.
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don't be so afraid of learning a new language. many languages are closer to latin roots than english is. you WILL be able to communicate your thoughts better, if that truly is what you consider an advantage.

remember that powerful modes of communication is one of the biggest advantages we humans have over the rest of nature's finest Written on 29/8/07
You know... reading this, all I really got out of it was:

"too bad".

do you really believe what you said about how 'everyone has the same opportunity in this country'? just looking at bi-party elections, the record gap between rich and poor, the ever present administrative racism, etc etc, makes me sick to my stomach.


Absolutely. I firmly believe that everyone has the same opportunity in this country - sort of. I also believe that certain groups do not collectively apply themselves as hard so they find it harder to get certain things.

killing of OUR real estate? that's funny. to put it simply, none of the real estate in america belongs to anyone apart from the native americans. the sooner you accept that fact the better. just because you killed them all does'nt mean it's your's, just like if i stole your car today, it's not mine tommorrow.


That's odd because last I checked, if you took my car and killed me - and no one did a fucking thing about it - it IS yours tomorrow (which is the more realistic metaphor concerning Native Americans).

Moreover, if you want to look at this land as if it is the Native Americans, then by all means do so, but I wouldn't expect the Native Americans with their new found land, very willing to let you continue to live on it or even be readily open to letting more illegal immigrants pop on over - remember - it's not their first rodeo.

Than again, you did defeat your own point. just because the illegals come over and try to make this land their today doesn't mean that it's going to be their tomorrow.

I still stand behind the fact that we as Americans do not have to allow people into the country. It's not law that our borders are open.

remember that our economy DOES run on illegal immigrants. do not forget that it's OUR lazy asses that create jobs for them, especially since they'll do it better, AND cheaper.


Have you ever held a blue collar job? You know what, I'll save you from lying - no. This statement wouldn't ever escape your mouth had you ever had a job or a blue collar job. Most immigrants, once they think they can get away with being lazy - will, just like anyone. The difference here is that they say they come over to work - then fucking do so.

Overall you seem to miss the point. It's not 1850, 1920, 1950, or 1980. It's 2007. America is allowed to say no and do something about it. Simply because Americans did something in the past is no real good reason to sit and say it is now okay for it to happen again. I mean, slavery and shit used to be okay, so I guess I should be able to go out and do it again huh? no.

don't be so afraid of learning a new language. many languages are closer to latin roots than english is. you WILL be able to communicate your thoughts better, if that truly is what you consider an advantage.

At no point did I imply I was afraid of learning a new language. I speak very fluent Spanish, however I do not see a need to require Americans to speak Spanish so that illegal immigrants can have it easier. I'm all for requiring a second language, but Spanish isn't a high business language. Japanese, Russian, German, or another language that is used in international business would be more appropriate, not some degraded dialect of a root language. I'm also very aware that English isn't as Latin based as other languages, it's more Germanic. Written on 1/9/07
If you're employing illegals, do you not see that you are part of the problem??? Without the incentive, the illegals would not come here. I think that's the first step - take away the jobs. Then we can start worrying about the sizeable problem (that you didn't address) of drugs, gangs, prostitution, etc . . . Written on 30/8/07
I agree, but I have no control over who gets hired and fired. I only know the legal status of the guys on my crews because they tell me. Written on 1/9/07
Sir, I applaud your writing and your opinions. Written on 27/8/07
Partly I agree to your opinion. But why is it a loughable idea to ease the immigration process? If you make it easy for a foreigner to become a legal (not necessarily a permantent) resident, he has to pay taxes, is somehow registered and is thence a productive member of your countries economy.
You yourself pointed out that as illigal immigrants they neither pay taxes nor contribute otherwise to the medical care/warfare system.
Written on 28/8/07
Here is the issue. Is the prospective immigrant a giver or a taker? You're either one or the other. This country has plenty of takers - we don't need any more. That's why the push in Canada, for instance, is for SKILLED labor. They want the prospective immigrants to be able to attain a high-paying job, which means they will pay significant taxes - hopefully providing more to the economy than they take away. VERY few illegals are givers, if any. They are a huge drain on our economy. I work in a large hospital in the South and I personally see Millions of dollars wasted every year on health care for illegals. The Emergency Room and Obstetric wards are a joke. And it's our tax dollars paying for it all. Let's get something straight - NO MEDICAL CARE IS "FREE"!! I saw that fool Michael Moore in an interview for his new movie talking about "free" health care. Can anyone be that ignorant? Written on 30/8/07
Yes... Michael Moore can be that ignorant. Written on 1/9/07
But why is it a loughable idea to ease the immigration process? If you make it easy for a foreigner to become a legal (not necessarily a permantent) resident, he has to pay taxes, is somehow registered and is thence a productive member of your countries economy.


It's laughable because then you get people who don't come here for the right reasons and it makes it easier to cheat a failing system.

It opens the door to receive more immigrants who'll come and milk a system not set up for them to reap benefits from. Written on 1/9/07
The only problem with immigration in this country is that we don't have enough of it.

In a free society, people ADD value on average. When labor and innovation are not oppressed by regulation and arbitrary boundaries like the Rio Grande, they work where the work needs to be done, they start companies that need to be started. This is all good, Ricardian economics. The world gets richer when we can specialize in the things we're best at.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Ricardo

Sure some are schlubs. But some start Google. The fact that the schlubs are a negative is not a fault of immigration, it's a fault of the welfare system.

So on average, in a capitalist society, people make the world richer. That's why we're richer than we've ever been - all over the world. More free people = more wealth.

It's really that simple. The ONLY time immigrants, legal or not, subtract value ("steal jobs" or whatever) is when they get here and essentially not free. They're not allowed to work or can't change jobs because of immigration issues. That prevents labor and capital from going where it's needed so less value is added.

Think about it this way, if walling off the free flow of labor is the path to prosperity, why don't we just put that wall around Detroit until they're rich? Don't want to steal jobs from the Detroiters!

So, if you want to be richer, and you want the world to be richer, bring 'em on. If you want to decrease illegal immigration, open up the legal channels.


more here
http://tinyurl.com/22hze4
Written on 7/11/07
Very interesting article with different perspectives on illegal immigration. However, you seem to be over looking a key issue. We can't seem to get a handle on stopping illegal immigration on either border which is contributing to so many illegal immigrants. But if illegal immigrants can gain easy access to our country, what about our enemies? This is no longer about illegal immigration, it is about securing the borders to protect our citizens against terrorist activity. We need to stop those that would seek to destroy the American way of life. There are serious issues attached to this debate, but no one, not even the candidates running for office seem to want to approach the true nature of this issue. The government has the means necessary to finance a continuous operation to remove illegal aliens. After all, we're able to finance a war on another continent! It's time to start addressing the issues that affect our lives as citizens of the greatest country on the earth. It is time to tell the Congress that they need to put aside their personal ambitions and political fund raisers, and to start doing the job they were placed in office to do. Serve the people who voted for them. Illegal immigration costs the American tax payer a tremendous amount of money. It robs health care from citizens who pay their entire working lives to insure they have healthcare when they retire. Insurance rates are higher because we are paying for illegals who can walk into any hospital and be treated, even ahead of citizens who pay through the nose for health benefits.
As far as the arguement for opening legal channels, they are open. There is a process that was established under the 1996 Immigration Reform Act that was modified by the Clinton administration to admit even more aliens into the country.
I am not against immigration. That's how this country started. Everyone that came here via Ellis Island has made a contribution that has made this country strong and prosperous. But illegals owe no allegiance but to themselves. They don't pay taxes, they don't contribute to Social Security, and they cannot vote.
Bottom line, we must secure and control access to the borders with Mexico and Canada to maintain the internal security of this nation. If two or three hundred illegals can cross in one night, how many enemies have figured out that they can go to Mexico and join in with the illegal crossings? Written on 9/12/07
I remember South Korea tried to send out all the illegal immigrants once.. but they stopped when they saw the 60% of their workers where there illegally, they had to do some changes on their plans.

Now, you had mention the immigrants that have kids here..

I'm immigrant, yes I'm here legaly might be a difference. I had the plan to have a baby in 2007 before an US enterprise ask me, several times btw, to come here to work with them... Well I mentioned them my plans and I wasn't about to change them. But you know, the first thing I did as soon as I receive the birth certificate of my baby? Was to give my baby my nationality.. so right now she's a us citizen but also Mexican and she will decide in the future where she wants to live.. luckly I have enough investments here and in my loved country for here to have a future anywhere she wants....And I'm not planning to use her as sponsor in the future.. but I'm afraid just because she is my daughter she might have troubles at school for xenophobic people. ... or Ignorant people.. almost the same.

Also, just to mention.. in the area I work.. mm I think there is just one US citizen there.. most of the workers are from UK, India and NZ... funny.. oh yes and all of us are Legally here..

As Canada. US let immigrants to come and will keep the coming until the country won't need them.(that would be never.. you know globalization.. hand work.. cheaper salaries.. all that stuff no one wants to do but has to be done.. etc).There are some conditions to work here. As an enterprise the company has to probe there is NO American citizen able to do the work they're planning to hire an immigrant to do... oh..but with the the "deal" between Canada-US and Mexico... now I think they don't have to probe anything.. I have to research more on that.. when I came it was basic to prove that.

I would love to go back to Mexico.. but you know.. there are not enough challenges there now for my career.. I might go to London next.. :) sounds fun to live there for a while.. Written on 28/2/08
Yes,America was built by immigrants. But by different sort of them. In the multi-ethnic society each nation possesses its own features. One came to America sell its brains- another to to sell hamburgers in Mc.

signature: "Nothing makes you forget about love like sex toys."

Written 1 week ago

Joe

Joe
We need immigrants to help our country grow. It's a fact and their work is proven. The only problem I have with immigrants are the young, crazy gang members with tattoo designs all over their bodies. Written 18 hours, 42 minutes ago

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